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Post by doodlesthebear on Jul 22, 2009 22:07:47 GMT -5
Again, I am making an attempt to breath some life into this part of the board!
My question is simple: Do you trust Zeno?
More specifically, do you trust Zeno not to go crazy-go-nuts and explode some heads again? This thread came from Zeno's remark that he hopes he will be trusted again. Do you think the characters are right to trust him (with their lives, or just not to kill people)?
I would prefer it if this topic was discussed, with logic, theories, and/or evidence, as opposed to just marking 'yes' or 'no'. kthx.
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Post by Odin on Jul 22, 2009 22:45:17 GMT -5
Based on my observations of Zeno I find him to be highly untrustworthy in all ways that count. The scotodino has a repetitive cycle of emoness confidence then violence starting back from when he managed to get Mye to start dating him spurning his confidence to to slaying (albeit acidentally) Mye to emoing out to being slightly more confident with himself to attacking tony (partially not his fault mind you there was the master) back to a state of depression to slight confidence when the Elites thought him to be important to blowing off charby's head (head case lulz) now back to a state of depression and I bet in the next page Tony will say something that bolsters Zeno's confidence. unless it switches scenes.
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Post by doodlesthebear on Jul 25, 2009 22:37:02 GMT -5
The funny thing about this is, I trust Zeno when Zeno is Zeno. But whatever the thing inside Zeno is, be it a scythe-creature, alternate personality, or some other outside force, I find it extremely untrustworthy. In one of the recent comics, Zeno says he hopes they can trust him again. Assuming that he's not gonna die (which I think is a possibility) then he'll most likely be trustworthy only after whatever's inside him is banished or destroyed.
That said, who agrees? Disagrees?
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Post by Odin on Jul 25, 2009 22:54:19 GMT -5
I find that to be an agreeable statement. Unfortunately I'm starting to think that even when he made that hopes he can trust him speech that red eyed thing that lives inside him was controlling him.
On that note I wish the third person who voted would come in and share their oppinion as well.
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rezie
Junior Member
Trypophobia you has it.
Posts: 64 
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Post by rezie on Jul 26, 2009 0:54:50 GMT -5
I haven't trusted Zeno since he got the scythe, it makes me wonder if he's being controlled constantly since he got the thing.
And even if they removed the thing that posses him I don't think there'd be any way to remove the "taint" from him i.e. someone new shows up and mentioned what's happened and they just give him a funny look and scoot away.
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Post by Odin on Jul 26, 2009 3:58:35 GMT -5
I dont think the scythe has any special life to it personally though i did give it life in a fanfic I believe it is more or less a key that unlocked an entity within zeno that seems to be him but not him. If he lives I think he'll get azzy.... oh but that has nothing to do with his trustworthyness really.
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rezie
Junior Member
Trypophobia you has it.
Posts: 64
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Post by rezie on Jul 26, 2009 19:56:15 GMT -5
I wonder if the evil "spirit" inside of him is not just some kind of split personality, I mean other than the times that he's been possessed by it he's been callo and kind 'ol Zeno.
Or perhaps the thing is some thing that runs in the family, maybe all Scotodino are like this...(haha that sounds very far-fetched eh?)
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Post by doodlesthebear on Jul 26, 2009 22:08:08 GMT -5
If all Scotodino are like that, it's no wonder they're rare. They wouldn't even need an outside force; they'd kill each other off every time they got jealous!
I can't really say if Zeno's problem is an outside force or just another facet of his personality. It really could go either way; we don't know what he was like before we met him. Or perhaps it's a problem he alone has, and he was 'killed' to keep whatever's inside him (or maybe just him) from murdering everyone.
I don't think he's constantly under the 'control' of something else at all times, especially if we're going with the idea that it IS Zeno who's crazy. I think, when not psychotic, he feels remorse and sadness over what he has done. The whole incident with the staff, however, seems highly suspect. We have absolutely NO CLUE where Zeno got that thing, nor what properties it posseses. Someone commented on DrunkDuck that it's possible that Zeno just gave Tony a sword of some kind. (perhaps a sibling of the scythe, then?) Of course, this is all speculation.
If we're talking AFTER Zeno's been purged of... whatever is in him, if that's possible, I think the level of trust will vary from person to person. I can see Tony and Hex witholding their trust longer than, say, Charby. What Mye would do, though, really has me stumped. She tends to be a wild card when it comes to the guys in her life; I can't ever predict what she's gonna do next. Who would be the most likely to trust Zeno, now or later?
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Post by Odin on Jul 26, 2009 23:37:51 GMT -5
that was my comment on the cane.  I concur, knowing Amy theres something up with the cane. TBH I dont know if it's Zeno has control or Zeno's being controled. |
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rezie
Junior Member
Trypophobia you has it.
Posts: 64
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Post by rezie on Jul 28, 2009 15:51:29 GMT -5
Ah scratch that Scotodino thing, I just looked at the strips involving his family, and quite frankly they act normal, not all deranged like Zeno when he's under control.
....
Anyone besides me notice that Zeno's not in the 800th strip?
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Waker
Full Member
Bibliophile
Posts: 140
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Post by Waker on Jul 28, 2009 18:58:43 GMT -5
Yep, Amy said that he's probably staying out of the room so Charby won't leave.
I doubt that the Scythe itself has a personality, at least in regard to how Zeno behaves. While the Scythe might be the source of that figure he was talking to during the party, Zeno's outbursts are most likely due to his long separation from others when he was living on his own. The scythe merely gives power to his tantrums.
As for whether or not he's trustworthy, I don't think so. Zeno seems to be the type that thrives on turmoil and misery, if things start looking too calm, he has to have a jealous fit at the first opportunity.
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rezie
Junior Member
Trypophobia you has it.
Posts: 64
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Post by rezie on Jul 30, 2009 20:33:32 GMT -5
I have to agree with that, perhaps the "shadow" is a personality that he developed while alone, like a split personality. Maybe removing the possession would permanently damage Zeno's personality.
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Post by doodlesthebear on Aug 1, 2009 22:39:36 GMT -5
Zeno's personality doesn't seem, to me, to come from being alone. When he was first introduced, he was living in the forest Eeyore-style, and he didn't start having problems with others for a while. Zeno's acquiring the scythe does seem to be the starting point for the massive amounts of crazy, approximately. But it's hard to tell what was due to the possession from the 'master' guy and what was his own craziness.
I tend to think that the scythe isn't 'alive', technically, but that it is a massively powerful artifact from the Scotodino. I believe that his outbursts are linked to that, somehow. We don't know ANYTHING about his past other than that he was 'brought back to life' by... some group of people, I can't remember who. He may have been totally off his rocker before and his contact with the scythe, and then his sister, are causing him to relapse.
The funny thing about all this is that Zeno was my absolute favorite character the first time I read Charby, up until Zerlocke endangered Mye and Zeno saved her. Now, Zeno is one of my least favorites, though by no means do I dislike him. There're only a few characters I actively dislike.
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Waker
Full Member
Bibliophile
Posts: 140
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Post by Waker on Aug 2, 2009 10:23:14 GMT -5
Many people say that he changed after getting the scythe, but what if dating Mye was the trigger for his inner crazy to come out? While he does come to the defense of others, the source of him freaking out has always been Mye.
It just doesn't seem that likely that the legendary artifact grants you the power to blow people's heads off, but in exchange makes you a super jealous boyfriend.
As for me, I never liked Zeno. Too needy.
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Post by Odin on Aug 2, 2009 14:41:16 GMT -5
I personally think that Zeno repressed a lot of memories and emotions that by recent event's have been unlocking creating a Bi-polar disorder from the him that he is now and the him that he was clashing and a third party trying to take over his mind didnt' help it any. I see Mye, the Scythe, and Zerlocke as catalysts for the unlcoking of repressed throughts since Mye is something that he loves and is afraid that will be taken away, the scythe is the power to protect her, and Zerlocke is a person that desires Mye.
He's been abused his whole life up until after he died and the elves or whatever they were that took him in after he was reserected and had the Y shaped scar were brutally murdered in front of him. I would imagine that anyone would be messed up after something like that.
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Post by doodlesthebear on Aug 2, 2009 22:11:29 GMT -5
Vagus, I would say jealousy over Mye could have caused him to freak out. For a while there, he was very happy with Mye and didn't seem to act oddly for his character at the time. The arrival of the scythe is probably used a lot as a starting point for the crazy because it's seems to be around a lot when the crazy manifests, and I don't recall him having trouble before. Of course, the scythe could be a catalyst, as Odin said; it took Mye, Zerlocke, and the scythe to cause him to lose it. The arrival of Zerlocke into Zeno's conciousness is close enough to the arrival of the scythe for both to be used as 'starting points' for crazy.
Also, Vagus, the scythe may not make you a super jealous boyfriend, necessarily. It could be a combination of the scythe's power and Zeno's crazy; the scythe lets him blow up heads, but Zeno chooses to blow up the heads of those who threaten Mye. Then again, the scythe (or Zeno's crazy inner person, or whoever that was who made him freak out at the party) seemed to be out for revenge for the Scotodino, so perhaps the super jealous boyfriend comes from wanting to protect the person closest to him, because of either his own or the scythe's desire to protect its race.
Odin, I don't recall any instances that pointed to Zeno being abused in his past. Could you refresh my memory, please?
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Post by Odin on Aug 3, 2009 0:37:04 GMT -5
Zeno remark's to his familly treating him like dirt and being forced to wear the loin cloth of shame somewhere in the archives.
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Post by doodlesthebear on Aug 4, 2009 22:52:18 GMT -5
Okay, this most recent page definitely pointed straight to 'untrustworthy' as far as Zeno's concerned. He seems to be trying to fight whatever's going on in his head, whether it be a split-personality or an outside influence. But Zeno's been shown to be weak-willed, so he probably won't convince himself to not do something he'll regret.
The line in the last panel, 'but you are alone', seems to indicate that Zeno does have a split personality. However, it could also be a scare tactic used by the outside force.
I think something's gonna happen now. We've alreay had Zeno blow up Charby's head, he can't do much worse than that without sparking what will hopefully be the main conflict of this story arc. Azelea is probably in for it, though.
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Post by Odin on Aug 15, 2009 0:44:13 GMT -5
Well now it's not so much a split personality as another him that is connected to him somehow and through the scythe cutting it cut himself... intriguing.
And not a proper noun to be found in this statement
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Artemisia
New Member
That which does not kill us can only make us Stranger.
Posts: 39
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Post by Artemisia on Feb 8, 2010 20:02:31 GMT -5
I trust Zeno.
He is fighting the "scythe creature" and Zeno seems to be winning. the others know of his powers and Zeno knows the creature. they wont hesitate to tap 'im on the noggin if he tells them to this time.
I agree that Azelea is in for it...
If what you said about Scotodino cycles is true then he shouldn't have another blowing up scene for a while and should be getting really depressed soon.
Kavonn and Hex seem to be the only ones that can keep that particular power in check, (reference to Charby's 2nd transformation) Kavonn is leaving but even Menu can hit him with a bat when he goes crazy.
He has a brotherly love towards Charby and probably Claire and Rosemary too but he, himself, seems rather neutral to the other Elites. The crazy bit of him is different and sort of like that little voice that tells you to lash out or grab things. The little devil on the shoulder but most people ignore that voice. Zeno can fight.
Maybe he needs a therapy session where he lets the other one out in the presence of Kavonn, Hex, Tony and Mye (possibly behind some sort of barrier) and a couple elites and Reena so they get a better understanding of this creature.
I trust that he understands the feeling and will fight more than he did with the master
therefore I trust Zeno
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Post by doodlesthebear on Feb 9, 2010 22:48:31 GMT -5
Hm, Artemisia, I'm not sure I would agree that Zeno is 'winning' against the scythe creature, if in fact there is a creature there at all. I would also disagree about Hex being able to keep Zeno in check; I think Kavonn could probably do it, but Hex is too limited in the scope of his powers. And really, that's not a reason to trust Zeno, just a reason to think he's not going to hurt someone.  However, I think I understand what you mean by trusting Zeno. You're saying that you believe him to be good-hearted and that anything he may cause will be unintentional, correct? I can respect that position. Though I do think he'd need more than a 'little' therapy to sort out his problems. |
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Post by ihonestlydontknow on Jan 27, 2011 12:19:58 GMT -5
Hm... Just commenting on some things that jumped out at me...
I think that cane is safe- or, depending on where Zeno got the cane, it was at least bought with the honest attempt at reconciliatory gift for Tony. That strange spirit that's messing with Zeno now is only focused on the Elites (or maybe vampires in general. We haven't seen Zeno interacting with regular vampires in quite some time, and he seemed to be pretty happy to be exploding THEIR heads.) and since Tony is an alp, and isn't tied to any vampire doings what so ever, I don't think it would try to mess with Zeno's gift. We'll have to see if that's true or not. But I think that if Zeno wasn't influenced at all --from the spirit or whatever it is, or any negative aspects that the cane may or may not have -- that cane would be an honest cane. Poor Zeno really is greatful to Tony for kicking the Master out of his head.
I think the first thing he did after waking up and figuring out what happened to him was to go down and thank Tony. he also, during that time, hugged Tony and called him 'his BEST friend'.
And I belive he thinks that. Before the cabin, he had one bright spot in his life- those elves that took care of him. (He admitted that he didn't know if his sisters' attention was for affection or torment) The rest of his life he's been belittled and tortured. He's like a shelter puppy. Tony helped, a lot, and then the alp takes it a step further and saves him from being posessed. And doesn't kill him. It's probably the nicest thing anyone's done for him since he got to the cabin. If Zeno had his way, as he is, he'd probably have thanked Tony every day if the alp wasn't avoiding him.
A random topic change, but I think Zeno wouldn't have freaked out at Zerlocke so badly if Zerlocke hadn't been an Elite vampire. Whatever is messing with him now does NOT like the Elites, it probably used Zeno's freak out at someone making a move on Mye to turn whatever feelings he might have had into murderous rage.
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Post by nightreflection on Jan 27, 2011 15:01:25 GMT -5
From the storyline it is clear that he is caring, if not severely insecure. But the cupid episode shows that he can be brutal and err, for lack of a better word, 'normal' at times.
I'm not sure how much of the jealousy is natural, but Master and/or the scythe aggravated it.
The scythe is not just trying to kill the elites specifically, and probably all other vampires, but it is trying to isolate him from everyone, constantly saying he does not need them.
I get the idea though that the scythe is an incredible control freak and won't ever really be satisfied with Zeno no matter how much he co-operates.
Zeno's mind appears weak, but bear in mind that you're comparing him to creatures centuries old, so it may not be that simple. Either way, it would appear he has the mental strength to fight off the staff with Master gone, but the scythe has a psychological edge on him.
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Post by the1truesushiboy on Jan 27, 2011 15:56:30 GMT -5
I think Zeno can be trusted to be bipolar and unpredictable. He doesn't have a terribly strong will, but he is adamant about protecting the ones he loves and will fight to his last to do so. Zeno may be influenced or controlled, but not in a way that he believes would hurt his friends.
As to what this wraith actually is, speculation produces too many results to come to any satisfying conclusion.
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Post by ihonestlydontknow on Jan 27, 2011 16:32:55 GMT -5
It's a pity that sometimes fighting to his last isn't good enough. He tried so hard at that party! IT made me sad. (But it was such a wonderful plot point it makes me rub my hands together in feindish glee)
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Post by the1truesushiboy on Jan 27, 2011 16:48:17 GMT -5
Fiendish glee... A feeling I am now well familiar with thanks to CTV. Also sounds like a brand of Laundry detergent. |
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Post by ihonestlydontknow on Jan 27, 2011 23:14:45 GMT -5
-snigger- I can see Amy using it for one of her ad-break pages. (The Soylent Jerky and She Sells T-Shirts ones...) Why can I see it being endorsed by a weirded-out K'ale?
-voice off screen- "Ok, read the script."
-K'ale, looking nervous- "Even though I can remove bloodstains with no problem, those stubborn grass stains always give me trouble. That's why I use- Do I really have to do this?"
-voice- "YES!"
-Bojo, offscreen- "Go get'em, K'ale!"
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Post by ihonestlydontknow on Jan 27, 2011 23:19:05 GMT -5
But, anyway, I think the scythe is trying to kill the vampires, it certainly blames SOMEONE for the deaths of the Scotodino, and he wasn't freaking out at the party near any of the other demons, just in the room of vampires. But I do agree that it is manipulative and wants Zeno to focus on getting vengance for a group that hasn't even treated the poor guy with any respect. It would probably have gotten along very well with Sasuke from Naruto.
Yes, I did just go there.
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Post by the1truesushiboy on Jan 29, 2011 0:50:53 GMT -5
I actually don't watch Naruto, I mean I've seen like ten episodes, so to each his own, but in my opinion, Naruto did to ninjas what Twilight did to vampires. Not that I'm avidly opposed to either; they just don't appeal to me in the least.
But that's off topic. I think you're right that the scythe has it out for the vampires; the elites, to be specific. Whatever the elites are, they did something to get the Scottodino in a huff. The history between the two is unclear, but I'm inclined to believe the elites are in the wrong and the Scottodino are victims. But that's vague and could be quite easily the case, so I don't know what to make of it. Both sides seem violently opposed toward the other at this point and Zeno's family is something that needs revelation to aid in speculation. Do they know anything about Zeno and his "destiny"? Perhaps that's why they abandoned him. Maybe the Scottodino of today have forgotten their past and they don't have clue, leaving the scythe-wraith the only one with any knowledge of it. Undoubtedly, we'll be seeing his sister in the future, but what will come of that meeting, only Amy knows.
P.S.
Alternate advertising campaign:
King Rodericke- "Attention underlings! Do you, like me, find it aggravating when you're enjoying a good drink, only to realize your victim has bled on your favorite garment? I recommend Fiendish Glee. It's the only laundry detergent that's guaranteed to completely remove blood stains. Enchanted with the blood magic of Lemuro tails I've gathered by hunting them to near extinction, this long time problem has been resolved for those who buy this indispensable product. And being the vampire king, I can't imagine not having Fiendish Glee."
Cut to Fiendish Glee logo- a voice says "Use Fiendish Glee to get blood stain free!"
Yup, that's why he hunted down the Lemuro... To market laundry detergent. XD
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Post by ihonestlydontknow on Jan 30, 2011 2:35:24 GMT -5
Yeah, sorry about that. I was super overtired and it seemed an appropriate comment at the time. In fact, I'm STILL tired.
Exactly. I'm inclined to agree- it was probably the Elites at fault. But, concidering that 'scotodino' means 'dark and terrible' and that Amy likes to suprise us the distruction of the scotodino might have been in self-defense. I mean, those demons who knew Zeno might have had a bigger reason to hate him than just the fact he's the scapegoat/whatever 'destiny' he's in for.
Also, for some reason, I keep catching myself thinking that the scotodino lived in another dimension. Why? Why?!?
P.P.S.: Feindish Glee, take three, Mye
"I look after a cabin filled to the brim with waaay too many boys" -dodges Menu chasing Foomy- "And I know how hard it is to look after them, especially when they insist on eating in the living room." -shows Crispo with dripping nachos, Mannick with spilled pop, and Charby with one of those blood bags- "So I use Fiendish Glee to get those stubborn grass, greese and blood stains from out of almost anything! It's magical, and, as a 324 year old zombie witch, I know magic. Trust me, it works."
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